Comments on: Living One Mac Generation Behind

By: Apple Fever - Today’s Top Blog Posts on Apple - Powered by SocialRank

Apple Fever - Today’s Top Blog Posts on Apple - Powered by SocialRank — Mon, 01 Oct 2007 10:23:40 +0000

[...] Living One Mac Generation Behind [...]

By: Josh

Josh — Thu, 06 Sep 2007 02:31:44 +0000

There’s certainly no shame in working on a machine a generation behind, even more than one. I do most of my “everyday computing” on an iBook G3. I bought it knowing that it was a previous-generation model; had I intended to use it for such things as programming or video editing, then I would have bought the prevailing speed demon at the time, the PowerBook G4.

It’s now going on five years old and has been great for Office, e-mail, Web surfing, watching DVDs, and other consumer applications. It doesn’t have the horsepower to handle Apple’s latest multimedia apps, and I’ve never expected it to. This little iBook may be antique but it is not obsolete. It allows me to do the work I want to do, the way I want to. Yes, I would be able to get rid of my Wintel tower if I upgraded to a MacBook Pro, but I don’t think that I would be that much more productive (and I’m sure that something else would manage to fill the void on my desk). Right now I just don’t need the extra horsepower or Leopard or anything that an Intel-based Mac provides, and so I’m willing to take the tradeoffs.

I think that is the heart of your question - tradeoffs. Not what are you missing out on, but is there something you’d like to do that your current Mac can’t? And you’ve made the answer obvious. There is some Intel-only software you’d like to use and you can’t do that on a G4. Of course, the difference between “would like to” and “need to” is an expensive one, but thinking different does often come with a price.

By: FOSHAN

FOSHAN — Tue, 28 Aug 2007 06:16:45 +0000

Sure, rendering QT can be slow along with some other processor intense operations. Yes, I’d like to run XP natively and dump Virtual PC. But it all works so well now that I don’t want to mess up a good thing. Buying a laptop is a crap shoot. Apple has the best odds in this game, but it’s still a matter of luck on whether you end up with a frustrating lemon.

By: Nick

Nick — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 18:11:31 +0000

I couldn’t agree with you more:

“Software keeps getting bigger and more bloated, why? Because software developers assume that people will go out and buy the latest hardware just to run the software. It’s a self-propegating cycle and everyone is guilty of it, Apple included.”

That is one of the many reasons why I left Microsoft for Apple. I feel Apple is also getting a little “too big”.

Consumerism is rampant everywhere we look in our society. As a consultant, I have dumbfounded many clients by telling them they didn’t need that software or such. I told them however, if they wanted to get it it was purely because they wanted it not because they needed it.

What I am also seeing more and more are people saying their old computers work just fine. It shouldn’t be understood as only hardware but software. Plenty of updated software just isn’t worth it. Some are only good for those who really use every bit of it. But how many of us use every bits and pieces of software? Probably not many.

Now for professional, that might be a different story. Overall, I agree with you. Did I come across otherwise?

By: AMGoff

AMGoff — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 17:12:35 +0000

Nick, agreed. But a big part of it is not so much resisting the newest hardware, but instead resisting the software.

Software keeps getting bigger and more bloated, why? Because software developers assume that people will go out and buy the latest hardware just to run the software. It’s a self-propegating cycle and everyone is guilty of it, Apple included.

The fact remains that a 603 still runs System 7 or OS 8 very quickly, but once you throw 9.2 on there things start to bog down and don’t even think of X. It all boils down to wasteful consumerism, if people could actually sit down and prioritize what they need a computer to do and be satisfied how it does it then these two year purchase cycles would decrease dramatically. If that were to happen software developers would be forced to trim the fat and optimize their code for specific systems once they realize people aren’t going to go buy the fastest computer out there just to run their software.

The market should respond to the consumer, not the other way around.

By: Nick

Nick — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 14:46:09 +0000

Yes, of course most everything does. The marketing frenzy that pushes people to upgrade to ge the latest can only last for so long.

I am starting to hear more and more about people saying they have enough and don’t need more. A friend’s laptop was dropped. He bought a new one. He gasped when I told him he was buying another license for Windows he already owns from his other laptop. Things like that are making people think a little.

My DVD player is still good. I have old cars, out of passion mostly. I old speakers, an old stereo and have no need to upgrade anything as long as it all works. Which should scare the industry and explain why things break down more frequently at earlier stages.

Either that, or I’m part of a wave that is not the early adopters but the second wave…

By: Nick

Nick — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 14:44:43 +0000

Yes, of course most everything does. The marketing frenzy that pushes people to upgrade to ge the latest can only last for so long.

Either that, or I’m part of a wave that is not the early adopters but the second wave…

By: Undrpsi

Undrpsi — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 11:05:58 +0000

This discussion can be about anything…cars, boats, TV’s. It boils down to 3 questions. Does your current (TV, car, or computer) still do most of the tasks demanded of it? Would the new (enter item here) drastically change your use of it? And last but not least…Can you afford it?
I replaced my well used iBook G4 with a refurbed Macbook (in black) core duo last year. Anything written in universal is faster than a politician voting for a raise. Anything older ran just fine but you cold tell the macbook was idling half the time. Last week I purchased a snow iMac at Fryes for $999 (4 days before they were $1499). It replaced HP PIV that was loaded out…the iMac runs XP faster than a PC box (boot camp). Did my old ones work..Yep. Did the new ones drastically change the way I do things…yep. Could I afford them….yep (especially the refurb and clearance sal prices).
My .02 worth..

By: AMGoff

AMGoff — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 23:36:06 +0000

H. Kintama - I don’t know how much processing speed you need but if a G4 still provides enough “oomph” for your needs and you’re looking for a nice machine for a good price, wegenermedia.com has some good deals on 15″ aluminum G4s ranging from $689 for a 1GHz to $849 for a 1.5GHz. Here’s the direct link:

http://www.wegenermedia.com/alum15.htm

I’ve purchased quite a few things from them and they are really good to deal with, they even offer 1 year extended warranties as an add on option. I’ve been seriously thinking about buying the 1.25GHz.. heck I might even go for the 1.5. Since I’ve been more than happy with my 500MHz G3 I feel there is more than enough room for another PowerPC upgrade before I make the switch to Intel, that fast G4 would problem suit my needs until say 2012 or so. Just imagine what kind of machines they’ll have out then, I’d probably be able to pick up a 16-core PowerBook by that time (I’m still hoping the change the name back!). Even G5s are coming down in price now so I even have room to do one more PowerPC desktop before I make that switch too.

By: Rowan

Rowan — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 22:34:11 +0000

I’ve posted before, see post #34 above. Macbook Pro 17 arrived yesterday. First impressions other than speed/size/capacity etc over the 12″ powerbook. Well, the biggest thing for me is that as this thing is hardly ticking over for normal computer tasks, versus the G4, the CPU isn’t working hard so it’s no where near as hot. Much quieter too, the fans only kick in with 3d Gaming, and so far is still quieter than the 12″. I love the size of the 12″ though, it’s a great little machine.

By: H. Kintama

H. Kintama — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 16:56:55 +0000

Powerbook G4, 1.5 ghz, 15″ with 2G RAM
The only time to upgrade is if your computer’s literally broken.

I bought mine 3 years ago because all my work is done for video editing and its been working great until now. I’ve had that lower RAM slot failure and its now in the shop (I’m paying for it since my computer is not eligible for that free Apple fix). It sucks, I’m out of work for at least of week, so I’ve been looking at either upgrading to the new MacBook Pros or even getting another G4.

So if you’re looking to upgrade and save some $$$, look into the refurbs; Apple sells refurb 2.4 ghz MacBook Pro. I’m a creature of habit, I hate upgrading anything, software, hardware or otherwise. So for $300 more for the cost of repairing my current G4, I could’ve bought a refurb PB G4 1.67 (with free shipping)!

By: Wysiwyg

Wysiwyg — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 15:44:36 +0000

Zappa, my faithul iBook G4, is flawless. But then Photoshop CS3 came, and sudenly I need a new computer. I mean, the smart selection and other tools can make my life easier, but do I need it? I mean, really really need it?

In part, yes. Speed is always a great thing to have, but what´s really getting into my nerves is the screen size. 1024×768 simply doesn’t cut anymore - specially with Aperture.

In reality, I´ll wait until next year to see what happens (mature macbooks, mature leopard), and buy an external monitor with bigger resolution. And start to save money for a new Macbook Pro.

By: Louis Gray

Louis Gray — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 20:04:54 +0000

@41: As I’ve mentioned here before, my work desktop is an old Dual G4 450 with 30 GB of space. It’s still trucking along, even after almost 7 years. It too is due for an upgrade, but I don’t have the perfect excuse yet. The fact that Apple’s machines have such a long lifespan is bad for them and great for us!

By: AMGoff

AMGoff — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 19:34:20 +0000

You guys are funny… my main portable is still a Pismo. That’s right a 500mhz G3, albeit running with a gig of ram and a fast 7200rpm hard drive. She still runs Tiger very smoothly even with a 100mhz bus and a paltry 8mb of video. Speed and value are relative terms. The only thing I use a laptop for is word processing, email, internet, music, and photos. So for everything I need this old G3 suits my needs just fine, who knows maybe I’ll indulge and pick up a 550mhz G4 upgrade from Dave Wegener since they only cost 200 bucks now. My main desktop is a G4-dually and still handles all of my heavy lifting just fine. The key to hardware longevity is not getting brainwashed into thinking you always need the latest software releases. Do you really need the latest version of iMovie if the last version suits your needs just fine? Older software is still just as productive as the day you bought it. I paid over $2000 for this machine seven years ago, while I feel I’ve more than got my money out of it I still think there are many more productive years left in her. Personally my next purchase will be a 1.25GHz Aluminum G4, prices on those are now down around $700. The only reason I’m even contemplating such a move right now is I’d like to use the Pismo as carputer in the Cadillac. But still.. to each his own I guess.

By: dbtodd

dbtodd — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 18:34:29 +0000

Kudos to Travis for working to squeeze more out of older equipment for his students. You are a hero. I hate to think our students are working with technology that is a “generation behind.” I think the feeling that comes out of most of the posts here is that we all want, but few need the latest. Let’s all put our credit cards away and step back from the Apple Store.

By: Travis

Travis — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 18:26:00 +0000

I am a high school teacher who is currently using a Lombard G3 333MHZ in my classroom as a second computer. With this I am able to present Power Points to my students from the middle of classroom and my school provided laptop can stay up on my desk over in the corner. I can also take this inexpensive laptop with me while I am on the road and leave my school provided ibook G4 locked in my classroom. Parts are still fairly cheap for the G3 and I do all of my own repairs on the Lombard when necessary. I guess it depends how cutting edge of software you need but for just simple e-mail, word processing and basic presentations you still don’t have to upgrade just yet.

By: Tim Evans

Tim Evans — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 15:36:43 +0000

I still use a 12 inch PB 1.5G at home and in the camper van. My wife is on a 12 inch G4 iBook. Being a Mac freak and engineer I also have a MBP and an intel mini mac.

All I can say is that if you are in the market for maing movies or sound, get an upgrade,
but
if not, then there is nothing finer than the 12 inch laptops. They shine in design over everything else.

My Wallet prays that a MBP 12 inch does not mateialise any time soon.

By: joeschmeaux

joeschmeaux — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 14:35:34 +0000

I’ll upgrade when the price of used machines goes way down. I recently upgraded from my 400 mhz G3 Lombard, which I got for $100 on craigslist to a 1.33 ghz G4 iBook, which I got for $300 on craigslist. After the Lombard, the iBook seems lightning fast to me. The refurb MacBooks are $850 + tax, but I can’t justify spending $550 more for one, as the iBook does everything I need it to do — which the Lombard couldn’t .
There are so many capable used computers out there these days that unless you need to run the latest and greatest apps at top speed, there’s very little reason to buy new, especially if you live in an area with an active craigslist!

By: dbtodd

dbtodd — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 11:17:03 +0000

12″ Powerbook G4. I would upgrade but why? I’ve had this for over 2 years and it performs fine. I don’t think I’m a heavy user, but routinely use Illustrator and Photoshop in my job as a scientist. It could be quicker, but I’m not unhappy yet. Besides, even getting “doored” on my bike and landing on my PB didn’t stop it. The dent’s give it character. I have a PC at home and put new parts in the damn thing every few months to keep it tolerable (quieter PS, bigger drive, new vid card, etc.). No need to do that with a Mac. Don’t fall victim to the hype just yet!!!

By: midbach

midbach — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 01:31:46 +0000

I’ve been toying with an upgrade too. I have a 2 year old 15″ PowerBook and it’s perfect. I don’t do video but I do notice it being a bit slow at times.

I really don’t need an Intel MBP, I want one. The big thing for me is money; do I sell the PB now and get a decent price or ride it out for another year or two and then sell it knowing I won;t get nearly as much for it?

Whatever happens, this PB is the best machine I’ve ever used

By: Matt

Matt — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 23:18:39 +0000

I’ve recently upgraded from an 12″ 800Mhz G3 iceBook to a 2.16Ghz MacBook - the speed difference is monumental! The iceBook lasted about four years before the dreaded logic board problem cropped up, which was a good excuse to get a new machine. I was initially put off by the horror stories of the MacBook, but it seems that all the nightmares of ill-fitting cases, soaring temperatures and mooing have been sorted (at least in my case - May 07′ revision).
The best thing about the iBook was the battery life; even in the last days I used it, it was averaging 3 1/2 hours, which I thought was pretty darn good for an old battery.
I’m lucky to get that with the MacBook’s new battery doing moderate work.
I still think the form factor of the 12″ PowerBook and iBook was unbeatable for being on the move.

By: Rowan

Rowan — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 22:25:15 +0000

The G4 was a great machine. I had a 24″ iMac and have a 12″ 1.5ghz powerbook, 768mb. I did the mod the other day to get iMovie’08 running on the G4, it was choppy and slow. Specific leopard features like Time Machine and Spaces are going to start to feel sluggish on the G4. I would personally use SuperDuper to put your data on an external drive, eBay the thing, and get a MBP. That’s what i’ve just done. Because the G4 still has a lot of value, and there are still some people needing to run some non universal binary PPC apps, but the Intel machines are the way of the future now. Or, you could keep using the G4 for ages, more and more apps will not run on it eventually, or will be slow, and then you can buy whatever is current a year or two down the track. Really up to you. I’ve sold both my macs and gone 17″ MBP because now you can put 4gb ram and a 250gb drive in a slim laptop with a Core2Duo 2.4 chip and 1920×1200 res matte screen with decent 3D, well I don’t feel like a laptop is such a constraint now as my only computer.
Good luck with whatever you decide, and it’s only a matter of time before you upgrade but how much time is up to you. If you’re mainly using it for email/work things and not video editing and more intensive stuff, the G4 may suit for a long time to come. Bear in mind you get better pricing on eBay if it’s still within applecare warranty. If viruses come to the mac soon, they may be Intel only, so you would want to upgrade if you don’t want to miss out on those :)

By: Lime

Lime — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 18:36:16 +0000

My powerbooks battery died (lived in a house with an electricity meter, I think the daily powercuts wrecked it)
However about 3 months later I turned it on and was asked to reset the date, and miraculously the battery began charging again!

Current charge: 3949
Max charge: 4166
Battery Loadcycles: 186
Age of Mac: 61 Months
Kernel Panics: 1
Reformats: 0
Operating system: 10.1 - 10.4

How awesome is this machine, just keeps giving and giving. Try and find a windows laptop that even comes close to competing with those stats!

By: Debbie

Debbie — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:51:39 +0000

With the new processor that allows Mac & Windows via Parallels it was time for me to move from PC and Mac to all Mac. I had an iBook and my Dell was getting old. When the time came for replacement, comparing the pricing and knowing now that the Mac will run longer the choice was easy for me.

By: Nick

Nick — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 14:54:40 +0000

My battery is fine, then again the recall probably helped. tricky situation when you need to upgrade this and that, or do you bite the bullet.

As always, your budget will dictate what will happen.

“random8r” Who’s whining?

By: Benji XI

Benji XI — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:48:34 +0000

I just wanted to ask, any other people with 12″ PBs of ~3 yrs in age, how is your battery?

Mine’s completely knackered, it holds enough charge for about 2 minutes then the machine cuts out. This normally happens when the power lead has come slightly detached.

I was considering a new battery and an HD upgrade, but at ~£90 for the battery, I’m not sure it’s worth it. What do people thinks?

By: Sarah

Sarah — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:18:30 +0000

Oh, and I also have a lampshade iMac back in my office at university (the last of such, with the widescreen), and she is running fine, with lower specs that my iBook, so honestly, unless you REALLY want a new one, I’d ask why you would really need it.

By: Sarah

Sarah — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:16:16 +0000

I have a 1.2 Ghz 12″ G4 iBook with 768 GB RAM, and she is into her 4th year now.

She now has a 100 GB HDD instead of the 30 GB one she came with, and I added 512 GB more RAM over what she originally came with. The battery has been changed 2 or 3 times (thanks to safety recalls) so that is running fine, I got a new charger a little while back, and I recently had to replace the keyboard after a foaming beer incident (don’t worry, it was a micro-brew).

I am thinking about swapping out the 256 board for a 1 GB one, so I’ll end up with 1.5 GB RAM, when student loans come through, as I am kinda concerned about her handling Leopard.

But as I am a PhD student she’s just going to have to last me for a couple years yet, as I simply can’t afford to upgrade … although, honestly, not too keen on the keyboards on the Macbooks, so I don’t have a huge drive, but I would like the speed, as I am noticing the lag sometimes … maybe go Pro when I graduate.

By: Oren Sreebny

Oren Sreebny — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 04:42:54 +0000

I’m just installing iLife ‘08 on my MacBookPro and I notice that iMovie won’t run on anything less than a G5, which is a bummer, as my desktop Mac is G4 iMac.

By: random8r

random8r — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 03:07:02 +0000

Stop whining… if you bought as late as you say, then you’ve got a 1.67 mhz machine which runs all the latest most popular software and will for quite some time.

Fusion is a piece virtualization software for intel machines, so it’s pretty obvious you won’t be able to use it unless it has the chip you’re running virtualization for! Just like if you’re running on an Intel machine you won’t be able to virtualize a PowerPC machine.

You’re not missing out on anything. If you’re concerned about the “very latest software” then you really should have upgraded by now. Intel machines have been out for a couple of years. Look around and you’ll realise that Windows machines don’t last nearly that long - not in terms of software, or hardware. You basically can’t run Vista on anything but screaming-latest machines. At least with OS X you can run the latest version on 4 or 5 year old machines!

By: Ingo

Ingo — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 01:37:44 +0000

I’m using a 17″1.67GHz PB G4 DL. I mainly use FF, Adium, iTunes, RSS Reader, QT, Office, and CS3 apps. I run all these applications w/o any problems. Yes, the new MBPs are way faster, but, unlike many of the current MBP owners, I have zero problems with, e.g., display, heat, and fan issues. I plan on using this machine at least until the next MBP revision comes out, if not longer.

By: Nick

Nick — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:48:33 +0000

I still think the 12″ was a consultant’s best friend. Why couldn’t they make that format again?

Probably heat and other technical concerns. I’ll wait it out.

By: Neil Anderson

Neil Anderson — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:35:39 +0000

Depends mainly on your financial situation. I’m still running a G4 PowerBook and happy with it although I’ve run out of hard drive space. A friend with deeper pockets bought a MacBook Pro Core Duo a few months ago. He’s in the process of buying a new MacBook Pro because they have Core 2 Duos now.

By: Nick

Nick — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:33:37 +0000

I feel the same way. I switched 4 years ago and still running on my 1.33ghz, 12″ screen.

It is the perfect road warrior. Unfortunately, the new laptops don’t look as appetizing as my 12″ miniature.

What I love most about my 12″ is that I go home and plug in my 21″ Sony. What frustrates me the most is that almost everything nowadays is Tiger only or Intel only.

I have no desire to retire this gem. It serves me well and after years of frustration with Windows, I feel I am finally getting my money’s worth with this laptop. So, Apple, don’t push it either. Linux is around the bend also.

By: Galley

Galley — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:15:38 +0000

And here I feel bad because my 11-month old MacBook has a lowly Core Duo processor, no 64-bit support and no 802.11n.